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JOINT BOARD OF SELECTMEN & BOARD OF FINANCE
SPECIAL MEETING DEC. 18, 2000
TOWN OFFICE BUILDING 7:00 P.M.
First Selectman Patton called the meeting to order at 7:00 P.M. with the following in attendance: Selectmen Ennis & Knight. Board of Finance members, Chairman R. Lisiewski, H. Becker, K. Blessing, L. Brown, and R. Hipsky, members of Willington Fire Dept. #1 and Willington Hill Fire Department, Boy Scouts and other members of the public.
First Selectman Patton commented that the only item on the agenda is the Fire Department presentation to discuss a proposal for a tax credit or stipend. First Selectman Patton commented that this will impact the town basically from now, and forever, as far as expenditure and what the definition of what a volunteer is. John Peters, a member of both Fire Departments, will give the presentation.
John Peters commented that in April, Tyler Millix, Chief of F.D.#1, formed a committee to address the declining membership in activity level of volunteers in Fire Department #1. John was named chairman; others on the committee were Tyler Millix, Stuart Cobb, Ray Gantic, Tom Smith and Carlton Csiki. Carlton Csiki is not a member of either F.D. but he headed up the LSAP study, he is a non biased, impartial person familiar with Town government. John commented that when studying this we saw 2 problems, 1. ambulance coverage from 5 PM to Midnight, Mon.- Fri., when paid people are not on duty and ambulance coverage on Sat. Sun. & Holidays and also when more help was needed. 2. response at all times to other emergency calls. We brainstormed all possible solutions. We decided to focus
on ambulance coverage. John commented that Tyler Millix said it best “when someone dials 911 they deserve to have adequate, appropriate and timely response to their call”. We looked at what other towns are doing, most hit the wall 12/14 years ago, Willington started to decline about 5 years ago. We are now also covering the ambulance with duty crew. Duty crew consists of members who agree to be on call for a particular 6 hour shift. In 1998 the State passed a law that enabled towns to give Fire Departments tax abatements up to $1,000. It is hoped that this reward system will increase volunteers. In September, W.F.D.#1 invited Willington Hill Fire Dept. to participate. Those members included Richard Claus, Robin Knight, Garnett Byram and Tom Snyder. The committee recommended tax abatement for the volunteers but not all volunteers are home or property owners. If they live with parents, rent or live out of town
the tax abatement will not help them. If we use stipends, payments could be made periodically to members meeting certain obligations.
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Stuart Cobb talked to the F.D. auditor regarding the differences. A stipend would be a check issued by the Town to the Firefighters, there is no emoployee/employer relationship and it could be issued quarterly. The draw back to the stipend is you must pay 14% on Social Security and you lose $1,000 in deductions, a 1099 is issued from the Town. The Firefighters must keep records of mileage, clothes, etc. A tax abatement is at the end of the year, the bank takes less in escrow, you do not pay Social Security and you have a $1,000 deduction. Not all Firefighters will qualify for a tax abatement. John Peters commented that if we are talking about 20 people it would cost the Town $20,000.00. We would like to see 44 emergency people in Town. If you were to hire one full time paid
person, including all benefits, it could cost close to $50,000.00 for a 40-hour week. Board of Finance Chair Bob Lisiewski asked what the criteria would be for eligibility. John Peters commented that there would be steps: 10% of all F.D. activities in a year, training sessions, emergency calls and monthly meetings, you would get $500; an additional $250 for certification of MRT, EMT or Firefighter I; an additional $250 for participating in 15% of all F.D. activities. Bob Lisiewski asked what the consensus is as to payment preference. John Peters commented that the members have not voted on it yet. The ordinance only talks about abatement, maybe we could do both, you could pick one or the other; we want input from both Boards. There would have to be a cut off for each year, when you could change what you want. It could benefit everyone. Pay per call is illegal in Connecticut; a quarterly stipend for maintaining activity is not
pay per call. Bob Lisiewski asked if there is any way around the stipend being income and was told no, it needs to be reported on your tax return. Bob Lisiewski commented that he personally favors the stipend; from the Board of Finance point of view we need an estimate of the cost before the end of March. The tax abatement requires an ordinance but the stipend does not. The earliest they could implement something like this is probably the beginning of next fiscal year. John Peters asked if we do the ordinance could we put the stipend in there also. Bob Lisiewski commented that doing that would lock in figures. John Peters read part of the proposed ordinance that gives the opportunity to amend the ordinance. Stuart Cobb commented that some towns cap the stipend at certain levels. Bob Lisiewski commented that we would keep a line item in the town budget and the Fire Department would submit to the Board of Selectmen. He
thinks it is doable. Richard Claus commented that it is the younger people who should be members and for them the stipend would be a better incentive. Selectman Knight asked how many F.D. activities are there? W.F.D.#1 has about 650 and W.H.F.D. had about 400. John Peters commented that the discrepancy is because they have only had dual tones since May when the duty crews started. It is currently at 95% and we hope to make it 100%. They hope to have the tones tell what equipment should respond to the call. John Peters asked if there is anything else they need to do or anything they missed. The town attorney should review this. Kathy Blessing commented that maybe we could consult our auditors. Selectman Knight commented that you have a goal to get to and it may be wiser to make a cap. Robin Knight commented that if you put a cap at $44,000 and you have 22 from each department it jumps the money up for the budget.
Tyler Millix commented that if we have to come back to you because we have 50 people it would be great. Selectman Ennis asked if they had any information on how this has affected other towns? John Peters commented that the ordinance was passed in 98, we do not have any information.
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Richard Claus commented that the emergency service problem is not unique to Willington, it is statewide. Rob Hipsky commented that it was stated that the #1 objective is the ambulance coverage, that is why you went to duty crews. The ordinance does not cover the medical needs of this town, we could approve the money and the ambulance would still not roll. John Peters replied that paid people cover from 5:00 A.M. to 5:00 P.M.; non-medical people can come and do many things. Ed DaGata commented that 70% of calls are medical. Rob Hipsky commented that if we spend $40,000, he would like to feel that the ambulance would roll, he would like to see different wording, the ordinance is not touching on the #1 problem with the ambulance. Someone could skate through, meet the criteria, collect
their money and the ambulance will sit. Richard Claus commented that because that 15% is an average, you need to go to the calls to make the requirements, there are not enough other activities to offset going to calls, but it doesn’t guarantee that the ambulance will roll. Al St. Louis commented that his concern is the same as Rob’s and he thinks that 10% is a low criteria for $500. Al asked if someone from Willington Hill would go and drive the ambulance and was told yes they are doing a combined duty now, sharing the responsibility. Robin Knight commented that many people could show up at the house, but the people on the ambulance, who take you to the hospital, could be tied up for 1–1½ hours, it should be written so that those people get the credit. Rob thought that perhaps something could be written in that you must do at least 1 ambulance run per quarter, or something like that. Tyler commented that unless we put 2
people there 24/7, we can never guarantee anything. We are trying to avoid paid 24-hour coverage. There will be gaps. The duty crews are working out well. There are concerns also for the fire calls, the last structure fire, 3 pieces of equipment never left the station. Ed DaGata commented that more people in town need to get involved. Bob Lisiewski asked if stand by, the duty crew, counts as activity and was told no. Tyler commented that for many of the firefighters their incentive is to help the people of Willington. Tom Smith commented that we have discussed a 2-prong approach, the overall health of the Fire Department and of making sure that there is ambulance service around the clock. Bob Lisiewski asked what Willington #1 is getting for the tower and was told $2,000 a month and that the committee plans to think about this in regard to the ambulance response issue incentive. Bob asked Chief Claus what the Hill is
intending to do with the Ruby money it will get and was told it is tentatively earmarked for rewards and incentives. Al asked if both departments are incorporated separately and was told yes. He understands that an abatement has to be an ordinance but does a stipend need to be. The stipend does not have to be. First Selectman Patton commented that the town would write the check for each firefighter. Bob commented that the money would not go into the F.D. budget; it will remain town money, when we get the paper work it will be doled out. Al asked how would this be approved. First Selectman Patton commented that it depends, an ordinance goes through the Board of Selectmen and Town Meeting, a stipend goes through the budget process. Al asked if you could spend all that money without a referendum? Bob commented that it will be in the budget process with a public hearing and referendum on the budget. Al asked what about a
referendum to see what people think, you are giving the existing members the same as new members and the minimum requirement doesn’t seem very high. Scott Trube commented that the fact is if enrollment goes up you have more bodies, more bodies mean more coverage. If there aren’t enough people now, you need something to get more people involved.
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Stuart commented that we came up with the 10% figure by looking over last year’s attendance. Things have changed over the years, people can’t go to so many things as they used to. John Peters commented that the town does not want to be libel if no one shows up to an emergency. We want our volunteer organization to be up to strength to do the job. We are trying to avoid hiring more full time people. Kathy Blessing commented that this is new territory, we need to move forward with it and if it becomes cumbersome on the budget over the next 5 years we revisit it. Lynn Brown commented that he understands the need to provide incentive. He is also concerned about the people that go 20% to 40% of the calls, we are not giving them any additional incentive to do that, is that
going to discourage them from participating in as many calls. Tyler commented that in the last 5 years we have not seen people participating at 40%. Tom commented that we realize it is a lot of money but firefighters get called at 2:00 A.M. and that can be hard to respond to. It is different circumstances than other volunteers. We do need to address duty crew and ambulance coverage. Kathy Blessing commented that she sees this as one of the first endeavors of both departments working together. Everyone is willing to talk and come to the table, she sees this as more cooperation between the Fire Departments. Robin Knight commented that we should talk to the town attorney and the auditors. Tyler commented that regarding the issue surrounding the ambulance and staffing, when we started the committee the money from the tower was earmarked for staffing of the ambulance, it is not going to anything else. First Selectman Patton asked the
members of the Boards of Selectmen and Finance if they had any questions. Henry Becker asked who would decide between the tax abatement and the stipend? He thinks most of the townspeople will go along with it. Will the Fire Department be happy with the Board of Selectmen deciding what way to go? John Peters commented maybe we could go with both? Rob commented that you put together a committee and made the ambulance the #1 objective; the ordinance does not accomplish that objective. Bob Lisiewski asked what do you expect to come out of this meeting with. John Peters commented that if you feel it is possible to go with both, we will bring it to the members, if you feel only one is possible we need to know. Should we look at duty crew credit, put more in the ordinance about the ambulance? Selectman Ennis asked if there are any strong feelings for one or the other? This could be the stimulus to get more volunteers and he is
for it. Selectman Knight commented that we need to talk about whether we could do both the tax abatement and the stipend, does any town do both? Stuart commented yes. Lynn Brown commented that we need to move ahead on this, if this helps, he is for it. First Selectman Patton commented that we need to look at the administrative process, the financial department, the Tax Collector and the Assessor. We need to pass it on to the town attorney, talk to the auditors and pass the information along to the committee. Richard Claus asked if the town attorney could be asked if there are other ways to provide funding and get around the paper work. First Selectman Patton commented that he would ask the auditors. John Peters commented that if they need input we will meet with them, we want to do this right. First Selectman Patton commented that we need to walk through this to see what it means internally to the town, we need to see
administratively what it means. If one is the clear-cut winner, we would probably go with that. John Peters commented that when you get the information let us know and we will schedule a meeting.
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SELECTMAN ENNIS MOVED TO ADJOURN THE BOARD OF SELECTMEN’S MEETING AT 8:49 P.M.
Selectman Knight seconded the motion.
VOTE: 3 YES (PATTON, ENNIS & KNIGHT) 0 NO
KATHY BLESSING MOVED TO ADJOURN THE BOARD OF FINANCE’S MEETING AT 8:50 P.M.
Rob Hipsky seconded the motion.
VOTE: YES (LISIEWSKI, BECKER, BLESSING, BROWN & HIPSKY) 0 NO
Respectfully submitted,
Mary Bowen
Secretary
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